meeting this month

[anchor]

does anyone know when the meeting for dnr is for the maryland crabbing season restriction and limits, i would like to attend, i think it is this month some time and where it is and what time it starts..thanks........rob

[anchor]

and is anyone else attending this meeting?

[crabologist]

Rob ,
The meeting is this Friday the 19th at 6 p.m.. It's in Annapolis in the Tawes Bldg. I believe that if you look in the crab news forum , you'll find the more detailed post from rivercrab . I'll look tomorrow if you don't find it . .................................................... Rick

[anchor]

thanks rick

[CRABSTER]

does anyone know when the meeting for dnr is for the maryland crabbing season restriction and limits, i would like to attend, i think it is this month some time and where it is and what time it starts..thanks........rob

Date of Public Hearing Addressing Proposed Blue Crab Regulations
 Has Changed to January 19
Maryland Department of Natural Resources (DNR) Fisheries Service has changed the date of the public hearing on the proposed blue crab regulations from Tuesday, January 9, 2007 to Friday, January 19, 2007, 6:00 pm at the Tawes State Office Building, C-1, 580 Taylor Avenue, Annapolis, MD 21401.

The proposed regulation clarifies and corrects crab regulations regarding crab pots, channel pounds and bank traps and recreational crabbing catch limits. The text appeared in the December 22, 2006 Maryland Register, Volume 33, Issue 26. Public comment will be accepted through January 22, 2007.

To view entire public notice click on the following link, http://www.dnr.state.md.us/fisheries/notices/2007/010307crabhearing.html

[CRABSTER]

SPORT FISH ADVISORY COMMISSION MEETING

Monday, May 15, 2006, 6:00 p.m.

Tawes State Office Building, C-1

Recreational Crabbing/TFAC Concerns:

 

This topic was originally scheduled for the cancelled April meeting.  Mr. Gary explained the origin at the January TFAC meeting:  TFAC Commissioner J.R. Gross brought up the topic in respect to competition between commercial and recreational crabbers for space.  A motion was made, and passed, “that the Department look into a cap on the number of licenses sold, and in raising the price of the non-resident recreational crab licenses.”  At the March TFAC meeting, “Gina Hunt, Assistant Director of Legislative and Regulatory Programs, discussed the motion made in the January TFAC meeting to cap the number of recreational crab licenses sold and to increase non-residence fees.  Mrs. Hunt explained that although the license is in regulation and is subject to change by the Department, there are functional problems in doing that.  The current license system, COIN, is not equipped to isolate the individual license holders.  Some of the crabbing licenses are included in other licenses, such as the $40 boat decal, and are not put into the system as individual crab licenses.  This license is the same for both residents and non-residents.  The Department cannot legally establish a fee that is unfair to non-residents; when these are changed, they are usually reciprocal fees.” (Excerpt from the March TFAC meeting minutes.)

Harley Speir explained to the Commissioners that most of the complaints were coming in from heavily used waters and this is a problem that is not easily solved.  The Department is not moving forward on anything at this point.

Commissioner Windley told the Commission that he would find anything against recreational crabbers unacceptable.  Commissioner Baynard feels that the TFAC will not let this issue go; but she feels that the Department has done everything the Commission has asked in this instance.

Chairman Gilford said he thinks the SFAC should not take a stand at this time, but wait to see if the TFAC continues to push the issue.

[joecrabbr]

Id really like to see how all this pans out, i dont see the limit of 300 ft of trotline passing. Its way to small, compared to the unlimited the commercial guys have  . I also dont think the problem lies in how many traps and licenses the recs have, crabs were plentiful last year, why are the commercials crying? They simply have to understand they cant have the whole river/bay to themselves.. imagine all the people this would affect... ramp permits would go down, recs wont need as much bait.. the little guys money goes farther then the commercial guy thinks, imagine all the tolls,gas,bait,food,permits,ramp fees,licenses fees the little recreational guy brings in, the state would lose that money  if they penalize the recs... they would lose more money than ,most people think!!! major money!!!!

[tattoo]

If you go make sure you give us a report. 

[crabbygramps]

                                ... UH....OH..!!!!
                                 

[rivercrab]

Id really like to see how all this pans out, i dont see the limit of 300 ft of trotline passing. Its way to small, compared to the unlimited the commercial guys have  . I also dont think the problem lies in how many traps and licenses the recs have, crabs were plentiful last year, why are the commercials crying? They simply have to understand they cant have the whole river/bay to themselves.. imagine all the people this would affect... ramp permits would go down, recs wont need as much bait.. the little guys money goes farther then the commercial guy thinks, imagine all the tolls,gas,bait,food,permits,ramp fees,licenses fees the little recreational guy brings in, the state would lose that money  if they penalize the recs... they would lose more money than ,most people think!!! major money!!!!

No the problem is recs dont have to report their catch..If they made you report your catch then it wouldnt be a problem. I also think the 300ft of line is to small..make it 600ft..Also either you use traps or a line not both at the same time. I dont have a problem really with what they do..I just feel a few bad apples where I crab has left me with a bad attitude about the recs and their gear..But the running count on rec to comm ratio is about 100 to 1. Cruise down the middle of the WYE on a Saturday in the middle of the day and count how many recs then count how many comms then you will see. Alot of crabs being caught and not reported to the state..Just like reporting your kill in hunting season..No difference.

[mike2u]

That makes sense to me,, Could never understand 1200' trotline and also 30 traps if we want.. I had a hard enough time with 600' and 15 traps... Which ever one you use you still will catch your crabs.. Lets start catching more Rock fish and I bet that would help, also read a good article about ghost pots in the bay. Interesting reading..

 http://www.bayjournal.com/article.cfm?article=2729

[Domino]

Mike, that would probably help if this were a crab population issue.  The issue as I see it is entitlement.  The commercial guys pushing this gear restriction feel entitled to the rivers and entitled to the crabs in them.  Therefore they resent the recs being there.  They would prefer we were all standing shoulder to shoulder on some dock each with a handline and a net.

[anchor]

domino, what rock you been hiding under, havent seen you post in ages. well here is my 2 cents. i have crabbed in maryland, delaware and new jersey and i can honestly say i have never had a problem with a waterman. i look at it this way, i will never have a problem with a waterman cause i will give the man as much room as he or she needs. tho i do love crabbing i know the man is trying to make a living and all im doin is looking for a extra bite to chew on. i have had 5 different comm. guys wave to me when i was done for keeping my distance and that was just at the wye. i can see what scott is saying i think we should have to report our catch, that way the state can set regs so we dont over harvest and have the same problem the whole east coast had with the rockfish moritorium. just my honest opinion.

[R D]

It's not a matter of wanting it all or resenting the Rec's,it's more the #s of Rec's and the huge amount of water that each one can take up with trotline and traps, Every fishery that we have that is Rec only is in trouble just because of to many people trying to catch it,you have already pushed out the pot fishermen out of the rivers and tributary's and now the comm. trotliners are being pushed out by sheer #s of Rec crabbers, all they want is a little room to work and some courtesy, We already know that even if your gear was cut in half that 5 yrs from now there will be twice as many of you on the water and the problem will still be there,5 yrs from now we also know that there will be less Full time Commercial watermen on the water too,in part because of resource problems and you can sit around and point fingers but your worst problems are water quality,loss of habitat and protection of predator speices(rockfish,drum,sharks)

Id really like to see how all this pans out, i don't see the limit of 300 ft of trotline passing. Its way to small, compared to the unlimited the commercial guys have  . I also don't think the problem lies in how many traps and licenses the recs have, crabs were plentiful last year, why are the commercials crying? They simply have to understand they cant have the whole river/bay to themselves.. imagine all the people this would affect... ramp permits would go down, recs wont need as much bait.. the little guys money goes farther then the commercial guy thinks, imagine all the tolls,gas,bait,food,permits,ramp fees,licenses fees the little recreational guy brings in, the state would lose that money  if they penalize the recs... they would lose more money than ,most people think!!! major money!!!!

The money argument has been used in every fishery and is still BS,we know that the recreational fishermen will still go,even with reduced gear and bag limits, been proven time and time again,including out of stater's,when I catch a bushel of crabs they are resold 2 or even 3 more times and the $$s i make are put in the local economy that week,not in the county or state coffers or a marinas bank account, I can promise you that the $$ that is made off a bushel of crabs I catch will go a lot futher than if you catch them,that said I don't think that the commercial industry has a lot of problems with Rec's going out to enjoy the day and catch them some crabs to eat but we all should have problems with rec's selling there catch or going over the bag limit,you should be pushing for more severe penalty's on violations and each and every one of you should be concerned about the increasing #s of people crabbing on the waters,you will come to a point to where you either reduce your gear and or catch or you limit the # of people,just the way it is in our world today,The Commercial side has already done both and may have to reduce futher at some point

[rivercrab]

Mike, that would probably help if this were a crab population issue.  The issue as I see it is entitlement.  The commercial guys pushing this gear restriction feel entitled to the rivers and entitled to the crabs in them.  Therefore they resent the recs being there.  They would prefer we were all standing shoulder to shoulder on some dock each with a handline and a net.

Heck I dont want the recs on the shore..Who would I have to argue with all day..Then I would have to bring my wife out everyday just to have someone to fight with 

[Domino]

Heck I dont want the recs on the shore..Who would I have to argue with all day..Then I would have to bring my wife out everyday just to have someone to fight with 

Seriously       You'd probably run by holding up crabs and taunting us

[rivercrab]

[Sam Hill] I do that now

[Domino]

I get it, RD, if they limit rec gear, the new found space in the rivers will eventually have the same amount of gear, just more boats tending it.  You've observed the rec gear saturation phenomenon, which BTW defies common intuition. 

That is: Regardless the amount of gear allowed to be used per rec, the sum of rec gear in use will remain constant.

"A body at rest cannot be stopped"

[R D]

I get it, RD, if they limit rec gear, the new found space in the rivers will eventually have the same amount of gear, just more boats tending it.  You've observed the rec gear saturation phenomenon, which BTW defies common intuition. 

That is: Regardless the amount of gear allowed to be used per rec, the sum of rec gear in use will remain constant.

"A body at rest cannot be stopped"

It just is a part of a growing population,and a certain # of them are going to go on the water,in 5 yrs the estimate is that in Fla we will have 2 million registered boats plus another 200,000 that are registered in other states,we all see the increase every yr,this last weekend i was told the ramps and waters were full,10 or 12 yrs ago you never seen anybody out this time of yr, even at 1 redfish and 5 speckled trout the fishing pressure increases all the time 

[Seaweed]

I get it, RD, if they limit rec gear, the new found space in the rivers will eventually have the same amount of gear, just more boats tending it.  You've observed the rec gear saturation phenomenon, which BTW defies common intuition. 

That is: Regardless the amount of gear allowed to be used per rec, the sum of rec gear in use will remain constant.

"A body at rest cannot be stopped"

I tend to agree with this also.  While I think 1200' is too long, and 30 traps is too many, if you cut the gear down without also reducing the catch limit, all that amounts to is people staying out longer and longer to get the same 2 baskets of crabs.  More beers consumed in the blazing sun = more idiots at the ramps = more fights, DUIs, heatstrokes, etc.

[joecrabbr]

No the problem is recs dont have to report their catch..If they made you report your catch then it wouldnt be a problem. I also think the 300ft of line is to small..make it 600ft..Also either you use traps or a line not both at the same time. I dont have a problem really with what they do..I just feel a few bad apples where I crab has left me with a bad attitude about the recs and their gear..But the running count on rec to comm ratio is about 100 to 1. Cruise down the middle of the WYE on a Saturday in the middle of the day and count how many recs then count how many comms then you will see. Alot of crabs being caught and not reported to the state..Just like reporting your kill in hunting season..No difference.

I agree with ya on mostly everything you said, but see some things a different way. Saturdays on the wye are [Sam Hill] for anybody commercial or not. If you look in the april reports of the TFAC you see that  the commercial guys are deliquent in thier reports
Letters for delinquent 2005 reports:

"Twelve people failed to meet reporting requirements in 2005 and were unable to renew their licenses for the 2006 season.  Each person was personally called to notify them.  Overall, the watermen took care of reporting; the delinquent list went from over 1000 to 12 in 2005.  For the 2006 reporting season, 884 delinquent notices were sent on March 27th. Watermen are responding and we are now down to 686 delinquent reporters; some of these watermen only missed one month."

Also why make the recs have smaller gear? If thats the case, the commercial guys should be limited to how many feet of line they can run. Also have them make starting time the same for everybody, why should the be allowed to crab earlier? I have no problem reporting my catch this season, but id bet the commercial guys would be all over the reports of how many crabs the recs caught, crying saying we are catching all the crabs!! One year its the prices are down, next year its the recs caught all the crabs, then its the gear they use. Im not trying to bitch about the how commercial guys, we are all in it for the same thing...CRABS!!! I  just dont like how they  try to limit the recs like we are to blame, i see it like this when i go crabbing i steer clear of the commercial guys, however they need to understand that when they are running 5000ft of line on a river that 5 miles long, they have 1/5 of the river to them, my 30 chicken necks in no way should be a worry to them

[joecrabbr]

I tend to agree with this also.  While I think 1200' is too long, and 30 traps is too many, if you cut the gear down without also reducing the catch limit, all that amounts to is people staying out longer and longer to get the same 2 baskets of crabs.  More beers consumed in the blazing sun = more idiots at the ramps = more fights, DUIs, heatstrokes, etc.

how do you see 1200 ft an 30 traps is too much when the commercial guys have unlimited catch an line? i guess two guys in a flat bottom working all day for 2 bushels if their lucky is a threat to the industry.

[peteboy]

 :)Dont worry, be happy! When gas prices hit 5 dollars a gallon there will be plenty of room and crabs for all of us. We might have to boatpool but hey its all about the crabs.

[joecrabbr]

:)Dont worry, be happy! When gas prices hit 5 dollars a gallon there will be plenty of room and crabs for all of us. We might have to boatpool but hey its all about the crabs.

i thought that was gonna be the case last year, ga scan hit 10$
 a gallon, ill still go

[rivercrab]

12 people out of 6000 didnt report..Well thats a big difference..And they where not dilinquent the whole season. maybe a month here or so. Im done with this conversation..Just stay away from me and we will get along fine. Ive seen more illegal crabbing from recs in one area so I can imagine what it is like all over the bay..Those boys in a flat bottom boat may catch 2 bushel  5 times a day..I see it everyday on the Patapsco. Ive been pretty forgiven recently but this season I think Ill be a big prick. They can let the recs run all the line they want..The comms should just get together and lay all the line they can in the mornings before the recs can start and it would put an end to all this BS. I can assure you there will be no room for anyone around me this year..I have 20k ft of line and Ill run with or without bait just to be a jerk commercial.

Also why should they reduce the amount of line the comms use..We do this for a living not for your Saturday crab feast or I owe my neighbor a favor here are some crabs...Maybe you should think about your job and ask your boss to hire 3 more people to do the same job you are doing and give you 1/4 the pay. But you wouldnt would you? Same difference.