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Author Topic: Making a trotline puller, looking for advice  (Read 16124 times)
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CaptMoose
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« on: February 10, 2009, 09:47:12 PM »

I'm making a #5 snood line for this season.  Will be my first time trotlining.  Thanks for all the input and advice here.  I may be on the wrong end of the learning curve, but it should be fun learning how to run it.

Anyway, I'm not one to wade into the pool.  I jump right in.  Everyone who has used a puller swears by them and wouldn't run a line without one so I am considering building a puller.  I have acquired a free 24v wheelchair gearmotor with hub.  Should be plenty of torque.  Don't know about RPMs- no data plate on the motor.  Probably pull my 15' side console right along.  For power supply, I found this device http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|328|51495|606044&id=672772 which will allow me to produce 12 volts for the boat & engine plus 24 volts for the motor at up to 85 amps (motor draws 15a) while adding only one battery to my skiff.  It will also charge them both off the outboard.  Does anyone have any experience with this device or battery combiners in general? 

If this is not advised, is there a way to have the motor rewound to run at a decent torque & rpm on 12volts?

Other than the motor power issue, I plan on using two 9 or 11" alum frying pans with a nice gradual edge for discs.  I was thinking of making a knife out of composite decking material or similar.  Frame & mount will be wood.

Any comments or advice is appreciated, especially if I'm barking up the wrong tree somewhere with my design ideas.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2009, 11:52:28 PM by CaptMoose » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2009, 09:54:25 PM »

I don't like  wood .............. Embarassed....well you know what I meen ... laugh but everything else sounds cool
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« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2009, 10:06:32 PM »

good luck with it .  Wink
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« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2009, 10:17:30 PM »

How water proof is the motor, salt water would damage it quick.
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Seaweed
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« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2009, 10:27:14 PM »

The frying pans sound like they could work, with the right shimming Grin  The knife takes a lot of wear... the composite would probably wear out pretty quick.  Can you make something out of bronze, or maybe aluminum?
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« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2009, 10:31:39 PM »

I'm just curious why you feel you need a line puller? I've crabbed using a trotline with quite a few members of this forum and none of them use a puller. I don't use a puller. Chuck Schnaitman runs 4000' and doesn't use a puller. I've never seen a rec crabber at the Wye using a puller.

I'm just wondering why you think you need one. Without unbaiting I can pull 1200' in 5 min.
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« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2009, 10:58:16 PM »

I break a ton of rules regarding proper nutrition but I do keep anything treated with arsenic like treated or composite lumber away from my food. There has to be something better you can use.
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CaptMoose
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« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2009, 12:07:19 AM »

For corrosion resistance the motor body is powder coated in good shape.  The gear head looks plated with zinc.  it was well used & has no signs of rust.  It is all sealed without any vents which is good. 

Thanks for the tip on the knife.  What causes the wear that I need to consider in the design and material?  Does the knife usually slide directly on the discs, or does it wear from the line rubbing as it is stripped off the discs?  Luckily I'm about 2 miles from a place called Jos. Fazzio's which has every type of metal under the sun as well as a giant flea market for guys selection of just about everything (in quantity).  So bronze/aluminum is available.  I don't have much in the way of metal shaping since I'm set up for woodworking.  Which would be easier to shape with a table saw/bandsaw/grinder/files?

 
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CaptMoose
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« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2009, 12:10:00 AM »

I'm just curious why you feel you need a line puller? I've crabbed using a trotline with quite a few members of this forum and none of them use a puller. I don't use a puller. Chuck Schnaitman runs 4000' and doesn't use a puller. I've never seen a rec crabber at the Wye using a puller.

I'm just wondering why you think you need one. Without unbaiting I can pull 1200' in 5 min.

I know I don't need one & thanks for the info on how long it takes to pull one in.  I had no idea.  Some moaning here about how long it took to manually pull after the puller went down made me think it took longer. 

More than anything, I like a good challenge when it comes to building something useful.  I'm in no hurry, but the idea has been churning since fall.

Seaweed, what kind of spacing should I shoot for with #5?  I read using plastic such as margarine lids works.  I tested some line with pans I had in the house.  I plan on using new alum pans from a restaurant supply in Philly (about $10).  No shims seemed to grab the line OK but that was dry.  The pan edge is more rounded, so I thought the shorter taper would save me some shaping time on the knife.  Is wet line more slippery & needs to ride down in the space between the discs further?  I love your table design & setup.  How's the wood working for you?  Do you know the RPM's of yours?
« Last Edit: February 11, 2009, 12:39:04 AM by CaptMoose » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2009, 12:36:00 AM »

Seaweed posted some great pics which are part of my inspiration.  http://www.bluecrab.info/forum/index.php/topic,9298.0.html
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« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2009, 12:51:31 AM »

Moose, Just my lousy opinion, but what in the heck do you need one of those contraptions for? If you have never done the trotline thing, you may want to give it a go first. I'm a rec and cannot see any benefit from having that thing on my boat. laugh laugh laugh
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« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2009, 04:26:05 AM »


CaptMoose,    To get that motor rewound for 12 volts, be prepared to spend more then the motor would cost new.    Expect to lose torque if rewound...    Over the years watermen have spent a lot of time & money developing a line puller...      The cost of a quality puller may be way more reasonable then piecing one together....   
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« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2009, 07:28:44 AM »



Seaweed, what kind of spacing should I shoot for with #5?  I read using plastic such as margarine lids works.  I tested some line with pans I had in the house.  I plan on using new alum pans from a restaurant supply in Philly (about $10).  No shims seemed to grab the line OK but that was dry.  The pan edge is more rounded, so I thought the shorter taper would save me some shaping time on the knife.  Is wet line more slippery & needs to ride down in the space between the discs further?  I love your table design & setup.  How's the wood working for you?  Do you know the RPM's of yours?

You're just going to have to trial-and-error until you figure out the spacing.  You want the pans, or wheels, to make a low-angle approach to zero gap.  the line will go in as far as it needs to to grip.

Those pictures are of my old 12V little winder. it worked fine, just not very fast or powerful.  The RPMs were slow.  My new winder is fast... not sure what the RPMS are... maybe 300-350.
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« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2009, 07:55:30 AM »

Weed, how much line do you lay out?
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« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2009, 08:31:12 AM »

 who pulls that  4000 ft what a man. i crab alone most of the time, i used to pull 3 1000 ft lines and it would take 45 min but that was taking a break between each line. i've used a puller for the last 2 years and wouldn't go without now. when i'm done and want to go home and my puller take 8 min to pull 2 1200 ft lines including get the floats and anchors,it saves my back and time. PS when i used to pull by hand i did it under power while steering also and with snood lines things can really get hectic.
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« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2009, 08:50:09 AM »

who pulls that  4000 ft what a man. i crab alone most of the time, i used to pull 3 1000 ft lines and it would take 45 min but that was taking a break between each line. i've used a puller for the last 2 years and wouldn't go without now. when i'm done and want to go home and my puller take 8 min to pull 2 1200 ft lines including get the floats and anchors,it saves my back and time. PS when i used to pull by hand i did it under power while steering also and with snood lines things can really get hectic.

Went crabbing with Chuck Schnaitman in Oct. He put out 3 lines (4000' I think) when we quit he pulled them all by hand probably took 15 min. at most under power.

My son and I pull 1200' snood line and unbait it and it only takes 20-25 min.
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« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2009, 10:26:09 AM »

Weed, how much line do you lay out?

100', sometimes 200' Grin

2400, sometimes 3600.  Its the time savings that make the puller worthwhile.  If one line is  not producing so well, and you have a fast puller, you're more inclined to move it.  Wink

I'd really like to see someone pull 1200' in 5 minutes, epsecially with any kind of wind.   Undecided
« Last Edit: February 11, 2009, 10:28:38 AM by Seaweed » Logged

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« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2009, 10:27:54 AM »

Yeah, definitely make the knife out of metal.
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« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2009, 10:30:12 AM »

Those pans might be a nightmare the more I think about it.  They'd have to be perfectly aligned with each other, otherwise the knife won't work right.  How are you going to get them both centered up?  Lathe?
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« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2009, 10:44:57 AM »

I think it would be alot less headache to buy some plates and a knife.  Them pans is just more work for yourself.
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« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2009, 11:55:48 AM »

I've considered this many times.  Out of curiousity I timed myself this summer...anchor to anchor it took me 16 minutes to pull 1200' snood.  If you have 3600' out or more and not catching that puller would sure be nice...some would say a must have.  For me, at this point, it would be a luxury.  Time = money for commercials.
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« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2009, 12:16:29 PM »

Dang and chuck can do 4000 ft in 15 min. like i said he's da man.
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CaptMoose
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« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2009, 04:50:54 PM »

Well thanks for more info on how long it takes to pull 1200'.  I'm a rec & that's what I'm making.  Just to clarify, I will be holding off on building the puller until I try out the snood line many times.  I was just thinking it would be a fun challenge and quite useful if it works.

Since the motor was free, I figured that was at least half or more of the expense to make a puller.  The pan idea was something I read elsewhere.  From what I could tell, the commercial discs are really made for thicker line.  Two strong pans back to back would taper down to nothing on their own and seem to work based on simple tests with moderate load.

Weed, I plan on finding dead center of each pan by drawing a series of diameter lines across the bottom.  They should make a star at dead center.  I will double check by placing them on a lazy susan and spinning them.  The center of the star should remain stationary.  Man, your puller must sling stuff all over at those speeds.

Oh yeah, a little background might explain my tinkering nature.  My uncle designs and builds alum commercial passenger boats in his spare time.  My grandfather designed and patented several machines.  One is an automatic clam shucker.  Works on water pressure & impact.  Many big clam processing plants use his machines.  He got his inspiration from watching seagulls open clams on the beach.  If you ever see a gull open a clam on hard sand, you'll see the theory in practice.  Tinkering is in my blood I guess.   It's fun to make something out of nothing.   In this case, an expensive piece of commercial machinery built out of restaurant supplies, bulk metal (knife) and a free HD motor.

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« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2009, 04:52:56 PM »

Just so I can get a feel for what I'm up against with the pans & fabricating a knife, what kind of clearance is typical between the knife & discs?

Will definitely go with metal, probably aluminum.
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« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2009, 05:06:09 PM »

All of the discs/sheaths I've ever seen are only flat for about 2"-3" (radius) out from the center and start to taper away from the center. The knife is also tapered (concave) on both sides to fit into the sheaths.
You should really invest some time into looking at functional pullers before you waste a lot of your time re-inventing the wheel.
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