commerical guys read

[mdjohn]

Pot buoys are not a problem for me since I have 2 eyes.  I've traveled the bay from Reedville, Va to Georgetown on the Sassafras River through miles of pot floats, and never once ran over one.  I also know how to properly operate a vessel and keep watch.

obliviously you are a daytime sunny weather boater.

I would be amazed, if you can see buoys at night with no moonlight at 20 MPH or 10 or 5

Yea, right, It's a different world at night .......  especially if you don't have a loran or GPS
 

and you ignore the problems with ghost trotlines
 

and if you never ran over a pot buoy - you don't get out much
 

[rapp414]

I agree with earlier comment that recs should be limited to a bushel and have to report .I guess the system isn't near perfect,but would hope they have capable people working on it,or continue tweaking it,I just don't believe anyone on here is more qualified to make the decisions than educated experts,I could be wrong though,it certainly wouldn't be the first time,just ask my wife

[crabbywaters]

New law.. Handlines with hotdogs as bait for now on.

[bigcrabrob]

i did the ghost pot recovery . none of the pots had any turtles , a few live crabs and a few fish . no pots where whole pots. just pieces and big holes in them . i hooked 54 pieces and only one was even close to being a fishable pot

[Dreampixels]

Of course all the numbers reported are good numbers - I mean no one would report less then they actually caught. Right

There is most likely no connection between those dead non reporting inactive licenses being phased out and an incentive to get numbers from the ones want to keep their licenses. I mean we do not know any one whom would not play by the rules.

[Mr. Ray III]

The major problem with rec reporting is getting recs to actually do it.  It would be a lot easier to just not report.  [Sam Hill], some crab on Wed. and most start early....now they are expected to fill out a report.     Most of the guys on here are honest and want to help the crab population-thats why they are here, and I believe most on here would be willing to report on their catch, if mandatory, its the other 85,000 recs that wouldn't care.

Rapp, the "experts" that you speak of are just people with a degree in biology.  The real experts are watermen.  They are the ones who are there every single day.  While they harvest, they learn also.  IMO people don't full understand the actual workings of a commercial boat, and the things watermen know.  Yeah, its simple to run a trotline and shake pots, but there is a lot more to be considered.  Bait up heavy, a storm is coming, crabs are gonna pot.  Bad water is coming, leave the pots as long as possible before the bad water hits so they load up, cold front is coming in two days, move pots deeper cause thats where crabs are gonna go, etc.  I'd bet these so called experts don't know this. 

Also, Rapp, you spoke of the WDS.  I wouldn't trust the DNR for their WDS as far as I could throw that dredge.  There are too many things that can effect it.  If the guy running the dredge doesn't know what he's doing, it can work improperly (too much line out, not enough).  Also, if its windy, the dredge could bounce on the bottom.  And the DNR is just a bunch of flat out liars.  They'll scribble some numbers to fit their agenda. 

Rant over.   

[willshawker]

The problem is recs.  Not blaming anyone, or attacking anyone but there is just so many we have Jo idea what they are taking and not to start a war but imo they are allowed too many crabs.

I'm a rec and I think this is interesting becuase I beleive it wouldn't help at all and this is the reason. I would say a majority of recs aren't out on the water weekly and when we are out there we aren't always taking our limits, infact I've talked to quite a few boaters over the years who dont even get close, the only people who take thier limits are the people who don't care and they will take over the limit anyway.

If you limit the recs (lets say 2 dozen) most boaters would follow as they do now but you would still have the guys out there who don't give a [dang] and will still fish them and you may create more of those guys by limiting 2 dozen. I would agree to limit on bushels per boat. 1 busher is enough no matter how many licened crabbers on the boat.

There are both recs and commericals out there who respect the water, the law, the crabs, and each other the problem lies with the recs and comms who don't respect those things.

We need DNR out on the water enforcing with stiffer penalties for both parties for violate. I saw DNR twice all last year and it looked like they where just cruising never saw them stop or pull up to anyone.

[rapp414]

Good points Mr Ray and maybe you hit the nail on the head,maybe the solution would be a joint effort or the DNR using BOTH waterman and Biologists.I'm sure there's valuable input that's needed from both.As a person who never went to college ,I know there's plenty that;s been learned from places other than books,but I also realize there is something to be said for educated people who've studied something and worked at it.As far as the reporting I agree.A certain number of people just seem to have to break rules.I feel for you Waterman,this is your living,for us recs it's a hobby,other hobbies can be found,other livings are not so easy to come by.

[rapp414]

Good points also Will,I know I personally refer to myself as"the crabbing kiss of death'.I've yet to get a whole bushel,I've gotten close,but never have.Also I doubt all 95000 licensees are out there that often.The smartest thing the DNR could do is raise the price of a license,and hire more officers,jobs would be created,and enforcement would be better,But how often does govt do the smartest thing ?

[willshawker]

I may take some heat for this but I also say only let Marylanders fish our waters. No out of staters unless its on a pier (for family vacation purposes) This would apply to comms and recs fish your own waters or buy from our comms and if your caught in our water its an automatic 5k fine and a boat towage

[rapp414]

Will I already had that "discussion" with a few others,as an out of stater myself,I would disagree with you,I only occasionally hit Md,but enjoy it when I do.Sad you feel that way,you're like a kid with the best toy,not wanting to share,and not realizing you share some of the others' toys.

[willshawker]

Will I already had that "discussion" with a few others,as an out of stater myself,I would disagree with you,I only occasionally hit Md,but enjoy it when I do.Sad you feel that way,you're like a kid with the best toy,not wanting to share,and not realizing you share some of the others' toys.

Yes we shouldn't share at this time. If you want to crab here move here and pay our taxes and fee's at least until the crab populations gets bigger. You guys are only a small chunk of the problem but still part of it and thats no offense to you personally

[rapp414]

I guess I'm misinformed,I thought the crab population was growing.Most people on here said the last few years have been great.Am I wrong ?

[tedbo]

Of course all the numbers reported are good numbers - I mean no one would report less then they actually caught. Right

There is most likely no connection between those dead non reporting inactive licenses being phased out and an incentive to get numbers from the ones want to keep their licenses. I mean we do not know any one whom would not play by the rules.

DNR needs to get off the comm's azz about needing more accountability...    We give our harvest reports every month.  Believe them or not.  If not, prove we are liars.  If the DNR would quit hanging catch shares over our heads, they wouldn't even need to worry falsified reporting. 

[flounderpounder]

[dang]..if they reduce crab limits for recs im gonna have to tow around a small flotilla of 12' jons behind me..

[crabbywaters]

Yes we shouldn't share at this time. If you want to crab here move here and pay our taxes and fee's at least until the crab populations gets bigger. You guys are only a small chunk of the problem but still part of it and thats no offense to you personally

That like pa people saying you can't come to our state to hunt or hike our mountains. That's like Hawaiians saying you can't come and see our beautiful islands and swim in our clear water. We start limiting what Americans can do in their own states, it wouldn't be call the UNITED states.

[jack1747]

Good points Mr Ray and maybe you hit the nail on the head,maybe the solution would be a joint effort or the DNR using BOTH waterman and Biologists.I'm sure there's valuable input that's needed from both.As a person who never went to college ,I know there's plenty that;s been learned from places other than books,but I also realize there is something to be said for educated people who've studied something and worked at it.As far as the reporting I agree.A certain number of people just seem to have to break rules.I feel for you Waterman,this is your living,for us recs it's a hobby,other hobbies can be found,other livings are not so easy to come by.

VA has the "Blue Crab Advisory Board".  It's made up of people from VIMS, a majority of Commercial Waterman and one Rec. The VMRC uses their input a great deal when working on crab rules and Reg's.

[Mr. Ray III]

VA has the "Blue Crab Advisory Board".  It's made up of people from VIMS, a majority of Commercial Waterman and one Rec. The VMRC uses their input a great deal when working on crab rules and Reg's.

We have the same thing Jack.  Except the comms are split from the sportys....and it don't work. 

  Explain whats so funny here and what you know about MD commercial reporting. 

[Mr. Ray III]

I'm a rec and I think this is interesting becuase I beleive it wouldn't help at all and this is the reason. I would say a majority of recs aren't out on the water weekly and when we are out there we aren't always taking our limits, infact I've talked to quite a few boaters over the years who dont even get close, the only people who take thier limits are the people who don't care and they will take over the limit anyway.

If you limit the recs (lets say 2 dozen) most boaters would follow as they do now but you would still have the guys out there who don't give a [dang] and will still fish them and you may create more of those guys by limiting 2 dozen. I would agree to limit on bushels per boat. 1 busher is enough no matter how many licened crabbers on the boat.

There are both recs and commericals out there who respect the water, the law, the crabs, and each other the problem lies with the recs and comms who don't respect those things.

We need DNR out on the water enforcing with stiffer penalties for both parties for violate. I saw DNR twice all last year and it looked like they where just cruising never saw them stop or pull up to anyone.

  The issue is not knowing or having the slighest clue of how many crabs recs are taking.  See, its the same way on this board as it is in the DNR.  You say, "I don't think recs are the problem, they don't take as much as you think" then others say "recs take more than you think".  Same in the DNR.  We need reporting because we simply don't know.

[bigcrabrob]

as a commerical waterman . i believe all recs shouldnt be allowed to catch any crabs . i mean if i want a tv i go to the store and buy one . i dont go and take what i want . i dont come to your place of business and take what i want . so i believe you should have to buy crabs if you want them . im sure alot of waterman would feel the same as i do

[fishingtom]

as a commerical waterman . i believe all recs shouldnt be allowed to catch any crabs . i mean if i want a tv i go to the store and buy one . i dont go and take what i want . i dont come to your place of business and take what i want . so i believe you should have to buy crabs if you want them . im sure alot of waterman would feel the same as i do

Yeah and you can't paint your own house, work on your own car, grow your own veggies or cook your own food...

[Mr. Ray III]

as a commerical waterman . i believe all recs shouldnt be allowed to catch any crabs . i mean if i want a tv i go to the store and buy one . i dont go and take what i want . i dont come to your place of business and take what i want . so i believe you should have to buy crabs if you want them . im sure alot of waterman would feel the same as i do

I totally disagree.  The TV store comparison is not comparing apples to apples.  People build tv's with materials they buy.  Nature does not supply tv's.  Nature supplies crabs, fish, etc.  No one hunts deer or geese commercially for money, so by your logic, no one would be able to hunt geese or deer, since no one sells them commercially.  

[crabbywaters]

as a commerical waterman . i believe all recs shouldnt be allowed to catch any crabs . i mean if i want a tv i go to the store and buy one . i dont go and take what i want . i dont come to your place of business and take what i want . so i believe you should have to buy crabs if you want them . im sure alot of waterman would feel the same as i do

[lone sailor]

Recs (and I believe the DNR) claim that recs take approx 8% of the catch.  However, I heard that the Smithsonian (or some outside company) did a study and informed the DNR that they were way off on the 8%, it was more like 35%.  And I wouldn't be surpised if its more. 

Just an FYI Tom, there are less than 5000 licensed watermen, and I'd bet less than 1000 full time watermen.  And I'd guess maybe 2000 active part-time and weekend crabbers.

Commercials have female catch limits depending on license size.  I don't see how people can keep blaming watermen. There are so many less watermen today than there was 20 years ago....but still, it's their fault.

I agree, perfect example is to  look at the watermans basin at the narrows, how many boats do you see leave on a regular basis, not too many. We use our lcc one or two days a week max. so that active estimate sounds about right. And it would not be out of line to say that for every recreational crabber catching under his limit there is someone going over. And about a rec. license fee increase even if it was doubled thats what $10 not much considering the huting license doubled too this year. And i dont see how it would drive people away form crabbing.

[shedking]

I guess by this logic then the coms should only be able to sell to MD residents. Their money is no good in MD, after all no other stateis so possisve of their own NATURAL resource. Never heard any one in DE complain about me coming. I thought the warm weather and teh approaching opening day would have quelled this smash mouth circus act by now. Build a wall and let the seperation begin