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A D V E R T I S E M E N T

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Author Topic: us vs them  (Read 14520 times)
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ChrisS
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« Reply #40 on: July 18, 2005, 11:38:17 AM »

Seaweed,
Do you crab in the Baltimore area? If so, we'll have to hook up on the water sometime. Like an above post, I have a 21 Carolina Skiff, all black w/ a black t-top, can't miss me. Hit me up on Ch.68 "Camerina leigh".
Obviously, my name is Chris. Grin
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in·teg·ri·ty   
–noun 1. adherence to moral and ethical principles; soundness of moral character; honesty
redneckshoreboy
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« Reply #41 on: July 18, 2005, 12:18:52 PM »

I have yet to see DNR so far....i have been at Bennets Pt mostly.....DNR would have fun with some of those jet ski's !
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HenPot
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« Reply #42 on: July 18, 2005, 12:44:13 PM »

It is funny that you should mention the Wye.  I haven't ever had problems there with anyone, except one jerk, who was a recreational.  The "us vs. them" I am not sure really holds true.  We have been befriended by a few of the commercials there, that point us in the right direction on a regular basis, let us know what depth they have been running and so forth.  There are good people there, IF YOU TREAT THEM WITH SOME RESPECT, THEY GENERALLY DO THE SAME.  You can find idiots everywhere, in the McDonalds, in the lawn mower shop, in the water, I don't agree that it has anything to do with what kind of crabbing card you have.

PS - I think you can make someone a idiot, by being a idiot yourself.
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pip
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« Reply #43 on: July 18, 2005, 12:55:04 PM »

You have to ask yourself what the impact would be if you took one side out of the equation, who would benifit most. If you outlawed rec crabbing I doubt there would be much change for the good or bad for the commercial crabber. If you outlawed Commercial crabbing the rec. crabbing would improve dramatically. Obvious neither will happen, but it goes to show that the greatest impact of one side against the other is pretty one sided. The rec crabber gets the short end of the stick everytime and therefore deserves some respect for simply accepting the situation. Most if not all my posts on this subject have been pretty honest, not an attack on anyone just stating my opinion and situation. Any responce that could be construed as rude has come from..... Guess where? Doesnt that say something?
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redneckshoreboy
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« Reply #44 on: July 18, 2005, 12:56:52 PM »

IF YOU TREAT THEM WITH SOME RESPECT, THEY GENERALLY DO THE SAME

You hit the nail on the head !
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crabbinmofo
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« Reply #45 on: July 18, 2005, 12:59:09 PM »

Redneck,

You got that right!  Jet ski's are a plague on both CC's and RC's.  I've never seen the DNR going after one and they (the jet skier's) are always breaking the 6 knot rules almost everywhere I go.  And I don't mean breaking it by a little bit.  That and jumping wakes.  I don't think this is lax enforcement, just that the JS's are crafty.

I think the DNR's main interests are:

1.  Making sure you have the proper equipment for your size boat which is important (including the 'sound producing device'.  How many boaters have been caught by that one?  Roll Eyes ).   I've seen more than a few people out in boats with small children not wearing like jackets, an invitation to disaster.

2.  Making sure RC's don't have under-sized or over-limit crabs.  This is logical, since many RC's don't know the rules for these categories.

3.  Checking catch sizes for recreational fishermen.

I think these are their main interests due to manpower/resource shortages.  I'm sure if they had the resources they would be on the jet skiers too. 

The DNR's job on the surface seems desirable in that you could be paid for being on the water all day, but the reality is it's a thankless, difficult job, in mostly difficult conditions.

Maybe it's coincidental, but I never been stopped by the DNR when I wasn't crabbing or fishing.  I'm guessing that the reason for this is because they can cover 2 or three reasons for stopping you if you are crabbing or fishing, whereas if you are just sitting there catching rays (pun intended) there's only one base to cover.

If I'm crabbing an area and the DNR makes an appearance, I usually get nearby to whoever they are boarding and let them board me next.  It saves them the time and me the trouble of having to deal with them mid-run.

C-mofo
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Seaweed
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« Reply #46 on: July 18, 2005, 01:28:15 PM »

Alright Pip, I apologize for my rude comments.  I just get pissed when I see a struggling way of life being beat further into submission, and closer to final extinction.  I realize its going, and the heydays of yesteryear will never return, but my old-fashioned nature makes it hard to watch it all die.  One day you'll only see waterman and their gear in museums, and then what?  Will you still be talking about how you were 100 feet away, and how you were there first?

The debate will never end.  Lets just get on with it.
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Git 'r dun!
redneckshoreboy
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« Reply #47 on: July 18, 2005, 01:47:54 PM »

It all comes down to....their are more people than water.....Man it use to be nice to ride down 404 for miles without seeing a car......and then when you did see a car you knew who it was......
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pip
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« Reply #48 on: July 18, 2005, 01:51:12 PM »

Thanks seaweed, and I hope it never goes away for you. I love the bay, the marshes and the water and have my whole life, part of the whole picture is the waterman and their boats, the smells of fish, crabs and everything else that goes along with it. I will continue to greet every situation with respect and hopefully will get some back in the future. My ultimate goal is not to make your life any harder, but in the same token not to be brushed aside myself as I do my thing.
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redneckshoreboy
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« Reply #49 on: July 18, 2005, 02:01:51 PM »

Spoken like true gentlemen ! !
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ken
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life is short play hard crab harder!!!!!!




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« Reply #50 on: July 18, 2005, 03:19:38 PM »

this whole thing went too far i was just saying about one bad exsperience thats all i like alot of commercial crabbers and never had a problem before i understand the commercial point fully and respect that and one day might retire on the wye  (lord help us all  )     but the case is one person can make it nasty for all....Now if thier is a guidline  ( unwritten rules  ) can you please email me and fill me in do to ive spoke to chuck and alot of other crabbers and never heard of these??? and i want to get along with a everybody and its not com vs rec  i was just asking a few questions thats all. i want to know the unwritten code of conduct.... i treat everyone with respect and as much honesty as i can and i deffinetly dont want anyone to have hard feeling to me or anyone else for that matter...Iv meet henpot and alot of other people on this board and others...the farthest thing from my mind  when i posted the question is making everyone mad at me i dont want or need that..I sincerly apologize if i offended anyone  thanks ken
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i_got_crabs
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« Reply #51 on: July 18, 2005, 05:08:26 PM »

I got crabs-He got crabs-she got crabs

But nobody should be crabby..

I respect the commercial guys and understand that this is the way they make a living..

Ever had a day when you did not want to go to work... they are human ya know..
we all have good days and bad days.. I remember reading a post where somebody was a saying somthing about.. how would you feel if you were at work and someone sat down beside you, took 1/2 of your desk, and 1/2 of your pay.. for fun..  after i read that, I understood, and my attitude toward commercial crabbers was changed forever.
We should all thank them for letting us borrow a corner of thier desk..
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ChrisS
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« Reply #52 on: July 18, 2005, 05:36:47 PM »

There's enough to go around for everyone. What most people fail to realize, it only costs a recreational crabber 5 dollars to crab the bay 6 days a week. A commercial it costs at least 60, ON TOP OF THAT, they are also being taxed on their harvest. They, commercial, pay way more to crab out there. Way more fuel, bait, food and at the end of the day, they must record they're harvest and monies from are than taxed. The recreational crabber gives 5 dollars to crab the bay, the commercial gives thousands of dollars, just in taxes!!!
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in·teg·ri·ty   
–noun 1. adherence to moral and ethical principles; soundness of moral character; honesty
ken
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life is short play hard crab harder!!!!!!




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« Reply #53 on: July 18, 2005, 06:34:58 PM »

yes but were not keeping no ware neer what they do and were not selling them.
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crabbinmofo
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« Reply #54 on: July 18, 2005, 07:02:49 PM »

There's enough to go around for everyone. What most people fail to realize, it only costs a recreational crabber 5 dollars to crab the bay 6 days a week. A commercial it costs at least 60, ON TOP OF THAT, they are also being taxed on their harvest. They, commercial, pay way more to crab out there. Way more fuel, bait, food and at the end of the day, they must record they're harvest and monies from are than taxed. The recreational crabber gives 5 dollars to crab the bay, the commercial gives thousands of dollars, just in taxes!!!

Chris,

What a commercial-centric view of reality. 

All of the things you cite as what CC's pay more for, RC's pay for also, but without a legal chance of recouping anything.

Are you saying if a CC pays $2.75 per gallon for fuel, that marinas and gas stations charge RC's nothing?  The cost per gallon is the same and the tax per gallon is the same.  If you use more you pay more.

Contrary to what you state, the huge majority of RC's are not crabbing 5 days a week.  That is a reason why CC's 'pay more'.  Also, whatever a RC spends for gas, boat rental (or purchase), equipment, etc. is not a deductible business expense as it is for CC's who can lower the taxes they owe by using the cost of these things to offset an equal amount of income.

The $5 the RC pays for a license allows them to keep 1 bushel per day for personal consumption.  The $60 the CC pays allows them to keep as many crabs as they can catch and allows them to sell what they catch.  Oh yes, the cost of the CC's license is a deductable expense too.  The RC's license is not deductible.

As to the 'thousands in taxes' that the CC's pay, you are  most likely referring to what they pay on the income from selling their catch.  The other stuff is deductible for them, but not for RC's.  It looks to me like the tax balance is heavily on the RC because he can't deduct the cost of anything.   And you probably find this hard to believe, but RC's pay taxes on their income too.  An equal percentage to what the CC would pay on an equal, after deductions, income.

Compare apples to apples and put all of the facts out when you make these kinds of statements.

C-mofo
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crabbinmofo
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« Reply #55 on: July 18, 2005, 07:12:59 PM »

I got crabs-He got crabs-she got crabs

But nobody should be crabby..

I respect the commercial guys and understand that this is the way they make a living..

Ever had a day when you did not want to go to work... they are human ya know..
we all have good days and bad days.. I remember reading a post where somebody was a saying something about.. how would you feel if you were at work and someone sat down beside you, took 1/2 of your desk, and 1/2 of your pay.. for fun..  after i read that, I understood, and my attitude toward commercial crabbers was changed forever.
We should all thank them for letting us borrow a corner of their desk..

I_got_crabs,

I may feel the same way too if the 'desk' and 'pay' in your analogy actually belonged to them, but as I understand it, the resource belongs to everyone. 

Try this analogy.  Someone takes half of your property, sells it to somebody, then gets angry because they think they should have been able to sell it all because it's theirs, not yours.

Analogies are like statistics, they can be used to prove almost anything, or nothing.

C-mofo
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Tuarus
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WOW CRABS! WHAT COULD BE BETTER OH YEAH MORE CRABS


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« Reply #56 on: July 18, 2005, 07:34:57 PM »

THATS A GOOD POINT MOFO.  WE ARE ALL PRIVELAGED IN BEING ABLE TO DO SOMETHING WE LOVE.  SO WHY SHOULD WE BE ARGUING argue WHEN WE ARE IN OUR HAPPY PLACE sunny ITS JUST A WAIST OF TIME AND WE SHOULD JUST GET ALONG.
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ChrisS
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« Reply #57 on: July 18, 2005, 08:42:44 PM »

.....if crabbing were lucrative, we'd all be doing it. Most crabbers do it everyday cause they love it. Your point regarding the taxes is correct and well taken, just exposing the otherside...... Smiley
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i_got_crabs
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« Reply #58 on: July 18, 2005, 09:07:12 PM »

Listen you crabbinmofo.. Grin


but my view may be tainted  Wink

last season after a nice but non productive day on the Choptank with my 6 yr old son, i was heading back in and bang.. my the engine died  Undecided  I tried every trick in the book but no matter what I did it would not fire.. ended up draining the batt... a CC who was heading back in pulled along to help out.. he towed us in.. the whole trip in he hollared over the constant drone of the big diesel about this and that.. asking about how we did and not be discouraged. when we docked I thanked him again and ran to get my truck/trailer when I got back to my boat I noticed that my son was grining from ear to ear  Grin the CC was heading back out.. I looked down into my boat. my son had an old brass whistel around his kneck and was holding the top open to one of my bushel baskets ,which was now full of some nice sized crabs  Shocked  the guy was now well on his way out.. freakin riding into the sunset like somekinda hero.. later my son told me the man said to blow this whistle if his boat broke again... How cool is that

only complaint... my son still drives me crazy with that whistel. lol  Angry



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crabbinmofo
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« Reply #59 on: July 18, 2005, 10:14:57 PM »

i_got_crabs,

That's a very nice, heartwarming story Smiley and good use of the smileys laugh.  The upside of the situation is you now have a 'sound producing device' when the DNR boards you for an inspection.  If I had been as fortunate as you, it would have saved me a few bucks when I had my close-encounter of the worst kind and didn't have the afore-mentioned device. Undecided

Neither side in this 'us vs them' is without it's faults.  It's the same with any situation.  I'm not saying there are no good CC's or that all RC's are good.  I'm just saying that CC's don't own the resources (crabs or locations), so your quoted analogy where someone took half of what was theirs is no more true than saying they are talking half of what's yours, or mine, or anyone else's.

C-mofo

PS - the salutation was pretty good too. laugh
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Of the 2 things for which you can wake me in the middle of the night, crabs is one of them.

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


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